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Used Games are "Defrauding the Industry"

Deathsythe | October 31, 2008 | Blog | PC Playstation 2 Company Misc 
David Braben, founder of Frontier Developments (who are responsible for Lost Winds) lashes out against the practice of buying and selling new, used, and pre-owned games.

According to him - the developers and publishers are getting shafted as a result of this practice.
Buying used games from a consumer's point of view is generally a positive experience: You get a game you want for cheaper than the standard retail price. What's not to like? And while people frequently complain (and rightfully so) about the amount you get back when trading games in at a store like GameStop, it's the developers and publishers who are truly being ripped off. We've heard complaints about the used game market from people in the industry before, but the founder of Lost Winds developer Frontier Developments, David Braben, has sounded off with some extremely harsh criticisms of the practice of buying and selling used games.

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Most recently commented on by HawkMan on Nov 2, 2008
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  • 0 thumbs!
    redneonfish | October 31, 2008
    David Braben. You are an idiot. Pre-owned games rock.
    • 1 thumbs!
      black doom | October 31, 2008
      No he isn't. He is looking out for the well being of developers. If developing games starts to become less profitable fewer people will be able to make them. Money makes the world go around and what you are keeping in your pocket could well hurt the next game you buy.
  • 0 thumbs!
    Darknet | October 31, 2008
    You're either taking money out of our pockets or out of their pockets. Nobody wins.
  • 4 thumbs!
    blackbelt38 | October 31, 2008
    If the developers are so concerned with losing money by trading games, maybe they should produce better quality games in the first place. I know when get a good quality game I won't trade it in because I know some day/month/year I will play it again for whatever reason.

    So what about places that rent games? Don't developers lose money on those too? What about used anythings? You think those manufacturer's get ANY profit from someone selling something used? It's the way of the world.
    • 1 thumbs!
      iLLmatic | October 31, 2008
      When I see used games like Metal Gear Solid, GTA, and Castlevania DX on the shelves, I don't think you can say the devs need to make better quality games. People are going to sell their games regardless of how good YOU think they may be.
  • 0 thumbs!
    anacreon | October 31, 2008
    This issue is similar with computer software. When you buy it you dont actually own anything you only own the license that lets you use it. You arent allowed to sell it without the company's permission. So companies wont lose money from buy/trade used software.
  • 0 thumbs!
    Livewire_19 | October 31, 2008
    In my opinion the problem is that new games are so freaking expensive, that's what fuel used game sales. People are more likely to spend $40 on a used game than $60 on a new game. That's the way I am, over the past 8 years I have only bought at most 6 brand new games at full price, and a majority of those have been in the past year and a half.
  • 1 thumbs!
    Deathsythe | October 31, 2008
    Some very valid points are being brought up in this discussion.


    Yes, he is looking out for the best interest of the devs and publishers, which in turn is in our best interest (in the long run, the ends justify the means)

    However, the price of new games is too high for many gamers, and one can argue that it is their own fault that we have sold / traded it in in the first place.

    At the same time though - once I purchase a game with $50 of my hard earned money, it is mine. I didn't purchase a subscription (in most cases), and I didn't purchase any kind of license. I purchased a hard copy of a media that is my possession. After I am finished with it, I have every right to sell it to another person. That is called capitalism my friends, and that's how it works.


    With the new growing trend of digitally distributed software and games, things may unfortunately change though.

  • 2 thumbs!
    kspiess | October 31, 2008
    Boo hoo hoo, boo hoo hoo, used games are ruining everything sob sob
  • 1 thumbs!
    black doom | October 31, 2008
    The question in my eyes is save yourself or save gaming. I am biased because I want to be a games developer but I choose to put the industry before my wallet.
    • 0 thumbs!
      iLLmatic | October 31, 2008
      That's a good point, and I guess I never realized how big the used game market is, because I don't buy used games. I'm not a developer, but I guess you could say I'm somewhat in the industry (I've done much professional outsourced beta testing and debugging and I'm on my way to becoming a developer myself), so I can understand where they are coming from. The whole problem is the consumers never care about the business side of things, not realizing that if the companies don't make money, they can't provide the products or services to them that they want.
  • 1 thumbs!
    Killosity | October 31, 2008
    My Wallet > Industry.

    Thats my mindset. Besides, the quality of games have decreased this generation for me anyway. (JUST MY OPINION, DONT WANNA HEAR "YOUR WRONG")

    Having said that, I buy new all the time. But rare games, and pre-owned games considerably cheaper are contemplated by me, rather than playing full price for a new copy.
  • 1 thumbs!
    kik36 | October 31, 2008
    I understand where they are coming from, I really do. And I try to support the industry with new game purchases as often as possible. But there are times where my family's needs come before the devs needs. It's not illegal for me to trade in a game and pick up a used copy of something I may not be able to purchase otherwise.

    I bought SOCOM with the headset. $60 and the game didn't even work. I haven't touched the game since, waiting for them to FIX the NEW game I paid FULL price for.

    I bought LittleBigPlanet in August.......HUGE supporter of it for a while now....it had the worse release EVER in the history of games, and the servers are shit....people are STILL having trouble getting online AND many still haven't even received their damn game!! (UK I feel for you!!) Amazing game either way, but c'mon.

    When I buy a car, I expect the car to drive in forward and reverse......not reverse only. And lately games have been feeling like they are put on the market unfinished and still charging full price!!!! That is bullshit and it's getting old.

    So my point is, Devs I feel ya!! If you release a working game that is awesome and I will buy it new first day. But if you sell me shit that's broken, don't expect me to sit there and do so twice. I will trade in the game for something that fits my budget and WORKS!!

    Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
  • 0 thumbs!
    Vermillion | October 31, 2008
    The companies have enough money to be concerned as far as I see it.

    Like said before, the prices are very high, that already is a good reason to stay away of them in my opinion. Kids can't afford 50$ for a Wii game, they can only afford about 30$ for a DS one. The price is a factor here.

    Also, if they are going to do something about used games in the future, they should focus in pirate games first.
  • 0 thumbs!
    HawkMan | October 31, 2008
    they need to start charging the retailers who sell used games.
  • 0 thumbs!
    kspiess | November 01, 2008
    You know all they would have to do is tell the used game sellers (namely GameStop) that they will hold back a full week from giving them the new game releases unless they reign in the used game sales, or give them a cut.

    They will never ever be able to stop used game sales altogether -- well, stop the stores anyways I mean. They already are trying to stop used game sales with the installation DRM, which they have implemented under the cover of 'preventing piracy' (which is BS.)
  • 0 thumbs!
    Big A2 | November 01, 2008
    I guess this just goes back to that old saying.. DON'T COPY THAT FLOPPY!

    But I agree with blackbelt38, we wouldn't have to sell used games if they didn't suck.
  • 0 thumbs!
    BANDITO ATTACK | November 01, 2008
    whiners.

    essentially, theyre complaining about the basic act of selling your own property to someone else.

    if i have a yard-sale and sell a bunch of games, am i defrauding the industry, too?
  • 1 thumbs!
    Final Blade | November 01, 2008
    As far as im concerned, im paying with my own money their games. So I dictate when where and how I pay for my games. Sorry there's so many factors with buying games. I've bought alot of games in my days at full price, but also pre-owned.

    As I stated in another article price of the games is a big factor as well as time to play games.
    • 0 thumbs!
      Killosity | November 01, 2008
      quote
      As far as im concerned, im paying with my own money their games. So I dictate when where and how I pay for my games. Sorry there's so many factors with buying games. I've bought alot of games in my days at full price, but also pre-owned.
      Exactly. Your putting yourself first and you recognise that there is financial commitment beyond gaming as a pasttime and therefore make informed and conservative desicions. Smart Indeed.
  • 0 thumbs!
    kokushishin | November 01, 2008
    Doesn't take into account someone becoming interested in the game (and through that the publisher and developer) via these purchases.

    Doesn't take into account getting multiple copies of the same game (Christmas etc.).

    Essentially advocates letting a game gather dust on a shelf (isn't the point to have someone PLAY them?)

    The only good point is that places that trade in etc. should have a detailed inventory.
  • 2 thumbs!
    Koloth | November 01, 2008
    Bah the whole idea is ridiculus anyway. First of all the people that buy used games are the same people that were never going to buy the game new in the first place. Therefore the developer has made all the money they are ever going to make on that copy of the game anyway.

    After all the developer can only make money on a game sale once. Now lets look at myself for a minute here. I buy plenty of game brand new games off the shelf. But they are games that I want generally in the first week or two of release. For instance Little Big Planet, Rockband 2, and Fable 2. Not going to wait long enough for them to go on sale or be returned used. On the other hand something like Heavenly Sword or Assassins Creed I would get used because frankly I didn't care enough to get them new. Still haven't picked them up. Therefore the developers are neither gaining or losing from me. I wasn't going to pay full price for the game. I might not even pay the used price. So where is the loss? You can't lose what you were never going to get in the first place. If you won't allow me to buy the game used for half price I'm just not going to buy the game unless I really really want it.

    Maybe as a greatest hits title for $20 then the dev at least get a bit of money out of me. But first they have to convince however many million people that Sony or Microsoft have arbitrarily set as the minimum for a greastest hits title anyway. Thus making plenty of money to begin with and the argument is moot. I'm sure Rockstar doesn't give a flying F' if all 10 million copies were traded back. They have still made back their money and then some.
    • 0 thumbs!
      Gamesta100 | November 01, 2008
      That's why I buy pre-owned games.Because I didn't want them enough to pay the full price to get them new and on launch or very soon after.Games that I only have a medium interest in.
  • 0 thumbs!
    Dark Arcanine | November 01, 2008
    Pre-owned games are fine, I have a couple. Handy for expensive games or ones that have been out so long they don't stock them anymore.
  • 0 thumbs!
    phowell23 | November 01, 2008
    if a game was actually worthy of the 60 dollar price tag i would buy it new or not resell it. Problem is there is no game i own right now that is worth that new (maybe NCCA Football 2009), so im just gonna buy em off ebay. If companies want to see what people think of their games look at what they go for on ebay.
  • 0 thumbs!
    HawkMan | November 02, 2008
    I buy usd games because they're cheaper. Why pay 60 when I can get them for 20 or 30.

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