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Bayonetta: More Substance Than Any Female Protagonist Before Her

January 10, 2010 in Blog comments 42

Tae K. Kim of Gamepro has written an article on whether or not he believes Bayonetta is a positive portrayal of a female game protagonist.

Go to the source for the full article.

I've come to a startling realization: Bayonetta may prove to be one of the most successful female video game characters ever. She succeeds on two levels: one, she is a positive embodiment of femininity and two, she kicks major amounts of ass. In short, she has far more substance than characters who are memorable solely for their looks -- think Lara Croft and the Dead or Alive
fighters -- yet she's far more "fun" than respectable characters likes Samus Aran and Uncharted's Elena.
Miss Razz via gamepro.com »
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  • 2
    Hideo1 Jan 10, 10
    quote
    positive portrayal of a female game protagonist
    Yeah, and Hitler's a positive portrayal of Germans, and Devil May Cry 2 is a positive portrayal of series rebooting, and the Wii is a positive portrayal of console advancement, and JRPGs are a positive portrayal of innovation, and you're a positive portrayal of Humanity.
    • 0
      Xeros the Slayer Jan 10, 10
      Maybe you should read the full article first.

      quote
      As I said in my review, I initially had trouble accepting the character of Bayonetta. I found the overtness of her sexuality to be off-putting and felt that it ultimately distracted from her true strengths.
      Everything about the character is over the top, much like Dante. However unlike most female characters in games, she isn't really defined by either 1 - being a complete bitch(WET's Ruby, the girl from Killzone) or 2 - being defined by the male cast around her.
      • 4
        Hideo1 Jan 10, 10
        No, she's defined by being a complete slut and a sexist cliche; much better =\
      • 2
        Shinobi_razor Jan 10, 10
        may not be a bitch but she does seem extremely arrogant and snobby from playing the demo. thats not any better.
        • 0
          conel3 Jan 11, 10
          If you could fly around shooting angels with your feet you'd be snobby and arrogant too.
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 11, 10
          doubt it. Dante doesnt have guns on his feet (seriously, WTF honestly?) but he does fly around sometimes and fights angels and hes not arrogant or snobby. he's very confident in his abilities and a bit of a smartass but thats it.
        • 0
          Drogo Baggins Jan 11, 10
          quote
          hes not arrogant or snobby. he's very confident in his abilities and a bit of a smartass but thats it.
          I don't mean to start an argument, but I think you just said Dante isn't arrogant because he is the definition of arrogant.
        • 0
          Hideo1 Jan 11, 10
          Confidence and arrogance are two separate ball games, smart assery and all.
        • 0
          Drogo Baggins Jan 11, 10
          I know. He said Dante isn't arrogant, he's just confident and a bit of a smartass. Being a smartass is what turns confidence into arrogance.

          I think you just reinforced my statement.
        • 0
          Storm Jan 11, 10
          Dante fought angels? When was this? :S Dante is quite arrogant, lol, especially noticeable in DMC3.

          But again, don't judge a book by it's cover, Bayonetta surely seems like a slut and stuff from looks and the demo, but the full game shows more character. She's still witty but yet, progresses as the game moves on.
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 11, 10
          no no. being a smartass does not make you arrogant. if you notice he just makes snide comments or jokes in cutscenes. theres a difference between being confident and being a total arrogant prick like Bayonetta is.

          and yes he fights angels. he fights all kinds of stuff, but in DMC4 there are levels when you are clearly fighting angels. even one of the bosses is an angel.
        • 1
          Hideo1 Jan 12, 10
          quote
          Smart assery and all
          Being a smart ass doesn't show arrogance, it shows cynicism.

          Arrogance is a sense of self-importance; being a smart ass has absolutely *bleep* all to do with it
        • 0
          Storm Jan 12, 10
          Actually, the "angels" are actually said demons, it's just their forms that look rather angel-like. Remember, as Nero's friend Credo claimed to be one, Nero denied it and said he had become a demon...besides, Dante didn't really fight that group, he had to mop up the demons that Nero fought, then he fought that statue thing from the priest.

          And how exactly is Bayonetta arrogant, and Dante not? As mentioned, the younger Dante carries some arrogance. Smart-ass has many meanings, being a rule-breaker or deviant are just a few of it's meanings. When people refer to others as a smart-ass, they would believe that person to think highly of themselves. The accused would feel important for being that know-it-all, having a sense of pride. And what does pride have to do with? Arrogance. To say there isn't at least a slight connection between the two is rather silly.
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 12, 10
          Dante was a bit arrogant in his youth, so DMC3, but you still are not getting our point that arrogance and smart assery are not the same thing.
        • 0
          Storm Jan 13, 10
          And you have yet to prove that they aren't connected. Being a smart-ass can easily lead to arrogance.
  • 2
    Curt Connors Jan 10, 10
    quote
    She succeeds on two levels: one, she is a positive embodiment of femininity and two, she kicks major amounts of ass. In short, she has far more substance than characters who are memorable solely for their looks -- think Lara Croft and the Dead or Alive
    fighters
    Nothing as badly written as Bayonetta can possibly be said to have substance, no way. As for the positive embodiment of femininity, yeah, women with freakish proportions and impossible figures are definitely positive role models
    • 2
      Hideo1 Jan 10, 10
      Especially the ones that get naked and thrust around like strippers; definitely someone to look up to.

      'Hey girls, if you want to get respect when you're older you need to act like a whore!'
  • 1
    Red 9 Jan 10, 10
    Want a female protagonist with substance? Look no further than Uncharted 1/2. Now those are some able-bodied women!
    • 2
      Seproth Jan 10, 10
      Protagonist means main character. Uncharted has one protagonist and that's Drake.
      • 0
        Red 9 Jan 10, 10
        quote Seproth
        Protagonist means main character. Uncharted has one protagonist and that's Drake.
        Meh.
        • 0
          Miss Razz Jan 11, 10
          The article writer did mention that Bayonetta is more 'fun' than Elena from Uncharted. I guess it depends on what your view of 'fun' is, but I'd take Elena over Bayonetta any day.

          There needs to be more Elena's in games, imo. Not more Bayonetta's.

          But then, maybe I'm just tired of the whole lets-see-how-outrageous-we-can-make-our-characters thinking that many Japanese games seem to have.
        • 1
          Red 9 Jan 11, 10
          That's the thing about Uncharted 2's characters; they're real, and you can relate to them. That's why I think Elena's such a good female character: she's capable without being a superpowered demon-fighter. You can relate to her in many more ways than Bayonetta.
  • 1
    Storm Jan 10, 10
    Sure the sexuality is there, but it doesn't really affect the game. It was more for sales I guess, sex sells. But at the same token, many are addicted to the action and gameplay style, rather than Bayonetta, who doesn't do too many 'whore-ish' acts. I wouldn't say she has more substance, but she's definitely a decent character in the gaming universe. Has her own style, charm, etc.. It's almost like a female Dante, haha.
    • 0
      Ech0ez Jan 10, 10
      I imagine the style was less about sales and more about been different. All of Clover's/Platinum's game are overflowing with style... some better than others. Although given the niche appeal of every single other title they've made it may well of been for sales.
    • 1
      Hideo1 Jan 10, 10
      quote Storm
      Has her own style
      quote Storm
      female Dante, haha.
      • 1
        Storm Jan 10, 10
        Those aren't independent sentences, pal. But if I must, I'll explain. What I meant by own style is that she's witty, caring, badass, and most importantly, has an amazing moveset (it's fleshed out and different from that I've seen before, especially with the Wicked Weaves)...in short, she has character, in her own unique way. And as mentioned, her moveset is different, very different. I mention Dante because...Kamiya's behind this project, it's clear there's similarities to Devil May Cry, hell they even reference it in a trophy/achievement, as Angel May Cry. Dante too has his sensibility, witty attitude, etc.. Comparisons are unavoidable, every "new" thing out is compared to something these days. One can compare the butterfly/flower bits from her jumping and forms to Okami, another Kamiya game.

        And besides, I said 'almost like'. xD
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 10, 10
          sounds like theyre made for each other. they should make a game with both of them and have them make out the entire time.
        • 0
          Storm Jan 10, 10
          I doubt it, they'd probably rather kill each other, their egos are rather big, neither wanting to accept who's the top gun of the relationship. Besides, a half light, half dark umbran witch with a half human, have demon guy would be odd. xD
        • 2
          Shinobi_razor Jan 10, 10
          do you not know sarcasm when you read it?
        • 0
          Storm Jan 10, 10
          I see it as a joke, but not as sarcasm. You could make it a little more obvious, lol. I mean, there are similarities between them, so I could see why you'd say that they are made for each other, but then that's not sarcasm now, is it?
        • 0
          Hideo1 Jan 10, 10
          quote
          do you not know sarcasm when you read it?
          Clearly not; you saw his response to me.
        • 0
          Storm Jan 10, 10
          How is that sarcasm?!

          I hate you guys. My sarcasm meter broke months ago and I still haven't gotten a replacement.
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 11, 10
          quote
          My sarcasm meter broke months ago and I still haven't gotten a replacement.
          clearly you need to hang out with DMD, PL, TLA and me in the Movies forum more often.

          ok i said they should make a game where Bayonetta and Dante make out the whole time. do i really need to put next to it so you get it?
        • 0
          Storm Jan 11, 10
          Yeah the whole time, but who cares about that. It's the rest of the sentence that I was more focused on. xD
        • 0
          Shinobi_razor Jan 11, 10
          maybe if they did, you could play as either of them, and in the first parts of the game you end up fighting the other one you didnt pick several times, but then they would decide to team up to take on something really evil.

          but it would be funny cause you could have Trish getting jealous from Dante hanging out with another woman all the time.
  • 2
    Smoke Jan 10, 10
    "The first action game heroine"? Does Gamepro have memory of a goldfish? I've only played the demo, but Bayonetta seems to have as much personality as Keanu Reaves, "Let's do some bad ass shit and then be nonchalant about it."

    As for female leads that had substance; Heavenly Sword, Final Fantasy 6, Perfect Dark (Haven't gotten around to playing Zero), and Mass Effect
    • 0
      Storm Jan 10, 10
      Yeah I thought that at first, too. But from the full game, as the story progressed, we saw her emotional side. She's basically going around with amnesia (she forgot about her past, learns it as we progress). So in any case, she's got no care in the world and just wants to have fun.

      But yeah, I think there are far greater female protagonists (in terms of substance) than Bayonetta.
      • 3
        Red 9 Jan 10, 10
        I think the amnesia is about the only redeeming characteristic of this woman. Everything else, from her idle stance to her spouting of things like "do you want to touch me?" just detract completely from her character.

        Why anyone would want her as a role model is beyond me.
        • 0
          Storm Jan 11, 10
          Well the amnesia bit makes her carefree, but later on in the game she gets quite attached to some of the characters and remembers her background. Obviously she's not subtle, very open and there's clear sex appeal, but meh, the game is overall more wacky than sex-appealing.
        • 3
          Hideo1 Jan 11, 10
          quote Red 9
          "do you want to touch me?"
          More wacky than sex-appealing... sure.
  • 3
    Seeker X Jan 11, 10
    What the...

    GET THE *bleep* OUT.
    • 2
      Hideo1 Jan 11, 10
      Thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaank you.

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